Fun_People Archive
30 Nov
Linguistics?

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From: Peter Langston <psl>
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 97 18:08:53 -0800
To: Fun_People
Precedence: bulk
Subject: Linguistics?

[A nice anecdote that has the ring of Urban Legend to it has been making the  
rounds lately.  It goes something like this:  -psl]

Forwarded-by: Holzwoman@aol.com

 A linguistics professor was lecturing to his class one day.  "In
 English," he said, "A double negative forms a positive.  In some
 languages, though, such as Russian, a double negative is still a
 negative.  However, there is no language wherein a double
 positive can form a negative."

 A voice from the back of the room piped up, "Yeah, right."

[But, like many obvious clever fabrications, this one has a basis in fact,
 in this case a large basis, as is demonstrated in the following spate of
 discussion on one mailing list last week...  -psl]

______________________________________________________________________________
 Date: Mon, 24 Nov 1997 22:25:04 -0500
 Subject: i was there digest #1


 From: Mark Seiden
 Subject: Re: double positive

 hmph.

 it was at a linguistics conference. i believe you are correct the
 actual retort was "yeah yeah" -- it was uttered by sidney
 morganbesser of columbia, and i was there.

 now, if only i could remember where it was...  it must have been '72-74.
 maybe it was an lsa meeting in new york?

 this might be a good question for Ask A Linguist
 <ask-ling@LINGUISTLIST.ORG> or for peter salus, phs@world.std.com who
 i seem to remember being present at this event. i'll cc him on it.

 by the way


 On Thu, Nov 20, 1997 at 06:59:25PM -0800, Anton Sherwood wrote:
 >
 > : A linguistics professor was lecturing to his class one day.  "In
 > : English," he said, "A double negative forms a positive.  In some
 > : languages, though, such as Russian, a double negative is still a
 > : negative.  However, there is no language wherein a double positive can
 > : form a negative."
 > : A voice from the back of the room piped up, "Yeah, right."
 >
 > Yeah, yeah.
 >
 > Way I heard, this actually happened at a ling conference.
 > Both speakers have been named, but of course I didn't save that account.

 -----------------------------------------------------------

 Subject: Re: double positive
 Date: Sat, 22 Nov 1997 11:06:57 -0800
 From: Jym Dyer

 > Way I heard, this actually happened at a ling conference.
 > Both speakers have been named, but of course I didn't save
 > that account.

 =o= Way I heard, it was *me* what said it:

 | Newsgroups: sci.math,sci.bio,sci.physics,sci.chem,alt.religion.kibology
 | Subject: Re: Why do "two negatives make a positive"?
 |
 | > But of course there is NO language in which two positives
 | > make a negative...
 |
 | =o= Yeah, right.
 |     <_Jym_>

 =o= Soon after I posted this, I saw this forwarded around
 the net without my name on it (but sometimes with my dingbat
 in front of it), allegedly excerpted from a discussion on a
 linguistics list. :-)
     <_Jym_>

 -----------------------------------------------------------

 Subject: Re: double positive
 Date: Fri, 21 Nov 97 06:18:17 -0800
 From: Tresy Kilbourne

 You, Anton Sherwood, wrote:

 >: A linguistics professor was lecturing to his class one day.  "In
 >: English," he said, "A double negative forms a positive.  In some
 >: languages, though, such as Russian, a double negative is still a
 >: negative.  However, there is no language wherein a double positive can
 >: form a negative."
 >: A voice from the back of the room piped up, "Yeah, right."
 >
 >Yeah, yeah.
 >
 >Way I heard, this actually happened at a ling conference.
 >Both speakers have been named, but of course I didn't save that account.
 I forwarded the story to the linguist Steven Pinker, who wrote back that
 the heckler was the philosopher Sidney Morganbesser. The story appears on
 p. 549 of his new book, "How the Mind Works."

 _________
 Tresy Kilbourne, Seattle WA
 "If English was good enough for Jesus Christ, it's good enough for me."
 --Sonny Bono, arguing to make English the Official Language of the United
 States


 -----------------------------------------------------------

 Date: 21 Nov 1997 12:15:46 EST
 From: Peter Capek
 Subject: double negative

 It happened at a Modern Language Association meeting in NY sometime in
 the mid-70s.  The event was reported in the NY Times at the time, but
 I didn't keep it, and have been unsuccessful so far at locating it via
 the NY Times index.

 I don't recall the name of the speaker, but the responder was Sidney
 Morganbesser, a professor of philosophy who I'm told has a
 well-deserved reputation for being an instant provider of
 counter-examples.

 In fact, the rejoinder was reported in the paper as "yeah, yeah."
 which I think is even more a propos than "yeah, right."  Not
 surprisingly, it brought the house down.
______________________________________________________________________________

© 1997 Peter Langston